I heard someone ask a legit question I didn’t have an answer for: Why is Israel in Palestine? Shouldn’t it be in Germany or Italy instead? The Palestinians didn’t do anything to the Jews. Germany and Italy did.
Viable point
Doesn’t it depend how far back in history you go?
Is there a dispute that the Jews inhabited this land thousands of years ago up until the Romans conquered them?
And is it in dispute that the Muslim armies eventually captured this land from the Romans?
Isn’t this why Arabs live there today and are called Palestinians?
Sure- if you limit your historical frame of reference to 20th century then I guess you have a point?
No, not really. The Jews of today have zero or little tie to Palestine as it stands now other than in a storybook. Again, a piece of a distant land was carved out for Jews and they were loaded with arms and military backing to overtake it, force those in it out, make then 2nd class or 3rd class citizens, etc. But, the people hurt by this weren’t the people who led the world to sympathize for such a venture, Germany and Italy. The Palestinians were the victims of this move, those who never did anything to the Jews up until their land was taken from them and they forced out. Jews of today have minimal genetic tie to the area.
Nope. They also forced them out of Palestine, removed their land titles, and made it illegal for them to own property there. Again, Romans not indigenous people.
Nope
First, Palestinians of today are not Arabic in any genetic sense, only linguistically and culturally…which occurred over centuries while they were living there before the Jewish population decided to go back almost 2 thousand years after the Romans forced them out, took their land and made it illegal for Jews to own land there. The Palestinians are incredibly diverse genetically.
In the north, people have a higher level of ancient Anatolian DNA, while if you go the south towards Egypt, people have higher levels of ancient Natufian DNA. They are a combination of the 3 stone age populations that shaped the Levant: Natufian, Anatolilan and Iran Neolithic. The average Palestinian genome breaks down to 35% Anatolian Neolithic Farmer, 33% Natufian, 20% Iranian Neolithic Farmer, 10% Caucasus Hunter Gatherer and 2% sub-Saharan African.
The Natufians were a proto-agriculturalist population that lived in the Levant between 15,000 and 11,500 years ago. Today this genomic component is most embodied in the Yemeni (Mahra). 35% are Anatolian Neolithic Farmer, which lived just north of the Natufians. Around 9000 years ago, they began to enter into Europe and the Levant, the latter forming a combination group called the Levant Neolithic Farmer. LNF makes up about 50-65% of the Palestinian genome. After the Stone Age, the Copper Age was characterized in the region by mass movement of the Iranian Neolithic people known as the Iranian Chalcolithics. Before the move, the people of the Levant were almost as different genomically to Iranians as East Asians are to Europeans today. Over the course of thousands of years, it brought a distinct Iranian characteristic to the Levant that set the stage for the Bronze Age Canaanites, which were a combination of the local Levantine Neolithic people (56%) and the Iranian Chalcolithic people (44%) to form the Bronze Age Canaanites, which were a northwest Semitic speaking culture that lived int he heart of the Bronze Age world. Based upon the DNA in the G25 database and the current Palestinian population, the samples show the current Palestinian population carry from 58% (Gaza) -73% (Palestinian Christian) of the Bronze Age Canaanite DNA.
For comparison…Ashkenazi Jews, like Bikki and my wife, only carry 20-25% of the same DNA dating back to Bronze Age Canaanites. In fact, the group that most closely aligns with and holds the most of that Bronze Age Canaanite dna are the Samaritans, with up to 80%, 2nd the Palestinian Beit Sahour, then Lebanese Christians, Druze, Lebanese Druze, Karaite Egypt and Iraqi Jew.
If you want to talk about religious claim to land, we can get into a LONG discussion of the divergent tribes of the time fighting over the worship of El vs Yahweh, and the myriad of Yahwists themselves and their battles over centuries. It’s not as easy to just say God said we could have it. It’s literally in the name given to Jacob, Israel - wrestles with El. El and Yahweh were quite different back in the day, Yahweh being one of the 70 kids of El. The Jews, after the 2nd Temple, were essentially the first recognized “Jews” as we know them, being Israelite and Hebrews beforehand, with all kinds of differing slants on the same Gods…and were polytheistic back then. The ones that won out, that we recognize today, were quite small for most of the time and quite radical for the time. They did win, though. Long story, fun topic. It’ll take me another 10 years to get a better grasp on it, though. Working on it. Lots of different groups in the funnel, though.
Again, however - Arabs, Palestinians, etc. had nothing to do with the centuries of torment Christians and then state powers like Germany and Italy or even Poland inflicted upon the Jewish.
There’s no argument that Israel was a problematic solution.
A lot of the borders that carved up the Middle East were designed to stoke conflict at worst. At best, they were made without proper regard to the local populations and tribes. It is kind of a mess.
At this point though what do you do?
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If you’d have asked me a year ago, it would be a different answer. But, today I’d say defund them 100% until they leave Gaza and establish a 2 state solution, which they never will. So, defund and walk away.